bridgetalk.com forums :: Laws & Rulings

JoAnneM

Jacoby 2NT ( 05:05:28 FriSep 27 2002 )

I maintain that J2NT and all of it's ensuing bids are alertable. For instance 1s-2nt-4d which shows a five card diamond suit should be alerted. Is this not right?

bluejak

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Re: Jacoby 2NT ( 12:14:27 FriSep 27 2002 )

While I am happy to help with alerting questions, it is important that you say where you are if you are asking such questions. Alerting differs from country to country.

In the ACBL, ie in North America, for example, calls after the first round above 3NT are not alertable, so 4

is not alertable in North America.

In England and Wales, natural bids are not alertable, so 4

is not alertable in England and Wales.

In South Africa, it depends what 4

is usually after Jacoby. If it is normally a void, for example, then natural is unusual, and that would make it alertable in South Africa.

But I would say that 4

is not alertable in most jurisdictions.

You say all ensuing bids are alertable: I do not believe that to be true anywhere! After all, some bids are just natural and not unexpected: how about 3

just as natural?

---
David Stevenson <laws2@blakjak.com>
Liverpool, England, UK
http://blakjak.com/lws_menu.htm

JimO

175 posts
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Re: Jacoby 2NT ( 12:32:04 FriSep 27 2002 )

Actually, in North America: most conventional calls above 3NT, beginning with opener's second rebid, require a delayed alert. (Except that alertable passes, doubles and redoubles require an immediate alert).

Since the 4D bid is natural, it is my opinion that it does not require a (post) alert.
However, since the ACBL Alert Procedure states "to insure full disclosure, however, at the end of the auction and before the opening lead declarers are encouraged to volunteer to explain the auction (including available inferences)", I would explain the 4D bid. (e.g., 5+-card suit, X of the top X honors)

---
-Jim O'Neil
Oak Park, IL

kjun

Re: Jacoby 2NT ( 13:44:45 FriSep 27 2002 )

this came up recently in one of my games... *all* replies to J2NT are conventional (with us at least), and we alert them as a matter of course... J2NT requires opener to bid a stiff at the 3 level or void at the 4 level and point count responses if no s/v is held...

while it's true that bids above 3NT require a delayed alert, we alert them immediately... but then we alert even mundane bids such as 1S:2S* as showing "exactly 3 card support"... we've even been (probably rightly so) snickered at for alerting the pass in 1D-(P)-1S-2C-P* here as denying 3 card spade support... it probably isn't necessary, but it seems right

JimO

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Re: Jacoby 2NT ( 20:11:05 FriSep 27 2002 )

If you are alerting immediately bids which require a delayed alert, then you are in violation of procedure, and may be subject to penalty.
There is a reason that these bids are to be alerted after, rather than during, the auction.

BTW, defenders are also required to post-alert:
E.g.,
1H - p - 1S - p
4C* - x - p - 5C
x - all pass
*= splinter
The defenders are required to post alert before declarer plays from dummy.
(Best is for partner of the person who made the alertable bid - in this case, opening leaders partner - to alert after the opening lead is selected, but before it is faced).

---
-Jim O'Neil
Oak Park, IL

Wotan

69 posts
bridgetalk member

Re: Jacoby 2NT ( 01:08:03 SatSep 28 2002 )

I don't know what the situation in other countries is, but here in Oz if you alert a bid that is not alertable you are in breach of the regulations and may be subject to a penalty. We are required to alert all bids where partner is privy to information which the opponents do not have eg
1C (P) 1H (1S)
2H showing 4 card support if you play support Xs is alertable.

Bids of opponent's suits and Xs are regarded as "self alerting" and bids over 3NT are not to be alerted. We don't have "post auction alerts but it is increasingly common for players to volunteer an explanation of bids the opps may not understand.

Ron Lel
[Edited By Wotan at 01:09:03 Sat Sep 28 2002]

Arciel

Re: Jacoby 2NT (alerting a non-alertable bid) ( 02:49:01 TueNov 5 2002 )

From Wotan:
> I don't know what the situation in other countries is,
> but here in Oz if you alert a bid that is not alertable
> you are in breach of the regulations and may be
> subject to a penalty.

From the ACBL Alert Chart --
"Many previously Alertable calls no longer require an Alert. However, when in doubt Alert (there is no penalty for Alerting unnecessarily but there may be one for failing to Alert when one is required)."

I cited this the other day when an opponent objected to my alerting a 3-of-a-suit bid after my partner's Jacoby 2NT. I can't find any clear direction as to whether or not to alert this, so I did.

Arciel (from the D.C. area, USA, since bluejak says we should say where we're operating from)

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bluejak

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International Bridge Laws Forum

If you need help with the Laws or rulings from
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International Bridge Laws Forum

If you need help with the Laws or rulings from any country in the world, this is the place!Hosted by David StevensonSenior Consultant DirectorEnglish Bridge Union

If you need help with the Laws or rulings from
any country in the world, this is the place!

Hosted by David Stevenson
Senior Consultant Director
English Bridge Union